Re: My proposal for Minimal E-Voting Standards and Privacy issues

From: Ed Kennedy <ekennedyx_at_yahoo_dot_com>
Date: Tue Apr 26 2005 - 20:26:11 CDT

Hello JamBoi and others:

Doug Jones, the election scholar at the University of Iowa told me that you
can't get anything certified unless it also includes a registration and
tabulation system. If I misunderstood him, perhaps he'll let us all know.
If we can't get the EVM (Electronic Voting Machine) certified without these
other items then they are part of the minimal standards. I would love to
focus like a laser on getting the EVM ready for certification as it's real
hard to go around and talk to election officials and tell them that they
shouldn't use a DRE when you haven't got an attractive alternative.

Yes, voter privacy is very important. The reason for voter privacy is to
eliminate the retail voting abuses of vote selling/buying and the
possibility of voter intimidation. To me, these are the only legitimate
reasons behind emphasizing voter privacy. It is clearly extremely hard to
design and develop a system that is not only private but is also auditable.
Our model is the accounting or transaction system. However, accounting or
transaction systems require the user to identify themselves and submit a
password. These system do not make any effort to preserve privacy. It is
simply too much of an administrative burden. Also, receipts our issued for
each transaction and a monthly statement is also published to the user as
well as a journal tape or equivalent. Virtually none of these
administrative tools are allowed when we stipulate voter privacy. Were not
voter privacy so important given the two practical reasons above, it would
be a high difficulty and low value design goal given the constraints I've
outlined. A reasonable designer would not otherwise aggressively pursue it.
So, let's tone down the rhetoric shall we? Put that energy into actually
getting the work done.

-- 
Thanks, Edmund R. Kennedy
Always work for the common good.
10777 Bendigo Cove
San Diego, CA 92126-2510
USA
I blog now and then at: <http://ekennedyx.blogspot.com/>
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JamBoi" <jamboi@yahoo.com>
To: "Open Voting Consortium discussion list" <ovc-discuss@listman.sonic.net>
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 4:47 PM
Subject: Re: [OVC-discuss] My proposal for Minimal E-Voting Standards
> By focusing tightly on the MINIMAL E-VOTING STANDARDS we can make a
> difference TODAY in the legislative battles that are taking place RIGHT
> NOW.  The other stuff definitately has value, but OVC's mission is
> focused on E-VOTING and this is an OVC list, so I'm going to suggest
> over and over again if necessary that we at OVC stick to our knitting
> and not allow ourselves to be pulled off-track by the wider issues.
>
> JamBoi
>
> --- Ron Crane <voting@lastland.net> wrote:
>
>> On Apr 25, 2005, at 2:38 PM, Edmund R. Kennedy wrote:
>>
>> > Hello:
>> >
>> > The word 'minimal' suggest to me that it covers the
>> > entire picture but not in great depth.  Perhaps the
>> > word you are looking for is fragmentary or 'elements
>> > of e-voting standards'?  As a general comment it seems
>> > odd that we're all for open systems but not open
>> > lives.
>>
>> It is not odd at all. Open systems give citizens control of
>> government.
>> "Open lives" give government control of citizens. I know which I
>> want.
>>
>> > How would you address the 'voter integrity'
>> > issue?
>>
>> I don't see it as a huge problem. I realize that others, however, do
>> -
>> and others yet pretend that they do. I have no problem with uniform
>> standards for voter registration involving the presentation - at
>> registration - of a birth certificate, naturalization certificate, or
>>
>> similar proof of citizenship: as long as registration is sufficiently
>>
>> in advance of an election to allow reasonable time to acquire these
>> forms of ID. I have no problem with making the registration database
>> available statewide, or even nationwide, to combat multiple voting. I
>>
>> have no problem with requiring the presentation - at the polls - of a
>>
>> form of ID, such as a photo ID or utility bill - that matches the
>> registration record, as long as that form of ID is available to
>> everyone for free.
>>
>> -R
>>
>> > Thanks, Ed Kennedy
>> >
>> >
>> > --- JamBoi <jamboi@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> Dear Ed,
>> >>
>> >> Yes, its true that I didn't address all aspects of
>> >> the broken parts of
>> >> our voting system and I'm not attempting a
>> >> comprehensive addressing of
>> >> all the problems.  Minimal is a key word in the
>> >> title.  I was trying to
>> >> focus merely on the E-Voting portion of it.  All
>> >> additional suggestions
>> >> for the whole voting system are needed and welcome,
>> >> but if we can
>> >> segment off and focus on just the Mimimal E-Voting
>> >> Standards portion of
>> >> it I think that will help us with the current
>> >> political/legislative
>> >> challenges that are going on right now.  OVC is
>> >> really focused on
>> >> E-Voting.
>> >>
>> >> Also I have to virulently oppose the statement
>> >> "privacy is a quaint
>> >> 19th century concept". Give me privacy or give me
>> >> death!  Liberty is
>> >> closely tied in with privacy.  I won't leave home
>> >> without it!
>> >>
>> >> Thank you for getting some great discussion going by
>> >> replying to my
>> >> proposal!
>> >>
>> >> JamBoi
>> >>
>> >> --- Ed Kennedy <ekennedyx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>> Hello:
>> >>>
>> >>> A couple of things:
>> >>>
>> >>> 1.  Q:  Why use touch screen voting?  A.  ADA
>> >> compliance and multiple
>> >>>
>> >>> language capability.  Also, it makes write in
>> >> voting a little less
>> >>> uncertain.
>> >>> 2.  You seem to neglect voting registration and
>> >> poll books.  Not only
>> >>> do
>> >>> votes needs to be accurately recorded and capable
>> >> of independent
>> >>> audit but
>> >>> only legitimate voters should vote.  After looking
>> >> over the
>> >>> Washington State
>> >>> elections it looks like the Republican party has
>> >> some legitimate
>> >>> gripes
>> >>> about the difficulty of voter verification.  My
>> >> personal solution is
>> >>> free,
>> >>> biometric ID's complying with national standards.
>> >> If this is a
>> >>> National- ID
>> >>> system, so be it.  We've already all got social
>> >> security numbers and
>> >>> privacy
>> >>> is a quaint 19th century concept.
>> >>> 3.  The person in charge of elections should be a
>> >> civil servant
>> >>> appointed by
>> >>> the judicial branch and confirmed by the
>> >> legislature.
>> >>> 4.  In light of what happened in Ohio, there needs
>> >> to be an adequate
>> >>> supply
>> >>> of voting machines and back up paper ballots.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> -- 
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks, Edmund R. Kennedy
>> >>>
>> >>> Always work for the common good.
>> >>>
>> >>> 10777 Bendigo Cove
>> >>> San Diego, CA 92126-2510
>> >>> USA
>> >>>
>> >>> I blog now and then at:
>> >> <http://ekennedyx.blogspot.com/>
>> >>> ----- Original Message -----
>> >>> From: "JamBoi" <jamboi@yahoo.com>
>> >>> To: "Open Voting Consortium discussion list"
>> >>> <ovc-discuss@listman.sonic.net>
>> >>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 4:10 PM
>> >>> Subject: [OVC-discuss] My proposal for Minimal
>> >> E-Voting Standards
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>
>> >> http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/4/20/181112/801
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Please Recommend and Comment.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> JamBoi
>> >>>>
>> >>>> JamBoi
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "Live humbly, laugh often and love
>> >> unconditionally" (anon)
>> >>>> http://dailyJam.blogspot.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >> __________________________________________________
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>> >>>> arthur@openvotingconsortium.org
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>
>> >> JamBoi
>> >>
>> >> "Live humbly, laugh often and love unconditionally"
>> >> (anon)
>> >> http://dailyJam.blogspot.com
>> >>
>> >> __________________________________________________
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>> >>
>> >
>> > -- 
>> > 10777 Bendigo Cove
>> > San Diego, CA 92126-2510
>> >
>> > 858-578-8842
>> >
>> > Work for the common good.
>> > My profile:  <http://geocities.com/ekennedyx/>
>> > I blog now and then at:  <http://ekennedyx.blogspot.com/>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > OVC discuss mailing lists
>> > Send requests to subscribe or unsubscribe to
>> > arthur@openvotingconsortium.org
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> OVC discuss mailing lists
>> Send requests to subscribe or unsubscribe to
> arthur@openvotingconsortium.org
>
>
> JamBoi
>
> "Live humbly, laugh often and love unconditionally" (anon)
> http://dailyJam.blogspot.com
>
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Received on Sat Apr 30 23:17:16 2005

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